NE one else like this idea? [Archive]

sLoWnStEaDy

02-02-2006, 09:29 PM

well, ive been thinkin again. Dangerous, i know. Back to the point ive been thinkin about gettin an old hot rod like 30s-40s 2 door. but i am sick of every fucking car having the same fuckin SBC engine. so i want to put a 4G63T engine in it. However im not sure what all it would take. somehow i would have to connect a RWD trans to it. i figure its not all that impossible, ive seen some much crazier shit in my days.

so who hates me? ive told 3 people about my idea 2 of which DIDNT like it at all! one who didnt really care.

RWSBIRD

02-02-2006, 09:48 PM

You are a genius. I agree totally. I am bored of seeing all these sweet cars that you know have the cookie cutter SBC engines. Don't get me wrong, I like SBC engines and I will probably put one in my own car but your idea is good. Imagine a '32 ford with a Taurus SHO V8 in it. Or an old wagon with a WRX STI engine and transmission as well as the AWD. Man it would turn heads for sure! That's just my opinion.

JunTyper

02-02-2006, 09:56 PM

Im thinking that you need to find a 03 cobra motor. ;)

Rollin on Dubs

02-02-2006, 10:16 PM

warchild145

02-02-2006, 10:31 PM

sLoWnStEaDy

02-02-2006, 10:33 PM

There is a reason why they use the cookie cutter sbc's and fords.

The point of a street rod is a big engine in a small car, Not a small engine in a small car, otherwise they would drive, Metro's Festevias and DSM's

...... I just grouped DSM's with Metro's HA

well i guess thats where my brain differs from others. first off there not really "small" cars to begin with. i mean how many 40's cars haev you seen that are "small"? Why does it have to be a big engine? IMO if you have a SBC pushin 500HP in a hot rod your like 100000 other people out there, if you have a 500HP 4G63T or other four cylinder engine in a hotrod your like no one ive ever seen or met or even heard about and in my book that makes you COOL!!
If you can make just as much horsepower why not be unique at the same time? i mean look at it this way. you have to IDENTICAL looking lets say 1949 Plymouth Special Deluxe', both with like 600HP. but one has a SBC and one has a 4G63T, which do you think would end up in a magazine or on TV or somethin? the one that is just like 100000 others or the one that is like nothing anyone has really seen B4? i dont know, may be my idea of "cool" or "custom" is different.

Fat_Turtle_Racer

02-02-2006, 10:47 PM

i think that is not the way to go if u wanna fuck something up try to put that in a golfcart

sLoWnStEaDy

02-02-2006, 10:53 PM

James... that makes no sense. c'mon this is your second screwed up post. you gotta do somethin about that shit.

persons is gonna think you aint got no learnin

RWSBIRD

02-02-2006, 11:08 PM

Rollin on Dubs

02-02-2006, 11:14 PM

[quote="Rollin on Dubs";p="96691":02ecd]There is a reason why they use the cookie cutter sbc's and fords.

The point of a street rod is a big engine in a small car, Not a small engine in a small car, otherwise they would drive, Metro's Festevias and DSM's

...... I just grouped DSM's with Metro's HA

well i guess thats where my brain differs from others. first off there not really "small" cars to begin with. i mean how many 40's cars haev you seen that are "small"? Why does it have to be a big engine? IMO if you have a SBC pushin 500HP in a hot rod your like 100000 other people out there, if you have a 500HP 4G63T or other four cylinder engine in a hotrod your like no one ive ever seen or met or even heard about and in my book that makes you COOL!!
If you can make just as much horsepower why not be unique at the same time? i mean look at it this way. you have to IDENTICAL looking lets say 1949 Plymouth Special Deluxe', both with like 600HP. but one has a SBC and one has a 4G63T, which do you think would end up in a magazine or on TV or somethin? the one that is just like 100000 others or the one that is like nothing anyone has really seen B4? i dont know, may be my idea of "cool" or "custom" is different.[/quote:02ecd]

Im gonna go out on a limb and guess that you have never drove a V8 that has HP/ Torque. Im not going to take anything away from high hp 4 bangers but its not the same as a V8 with power.

Most street rod guys want something that looks cool sounds cool and can make some tire smoke every once in a while. There not looking for something that has little to no torque and sounds like a 4 banger turbo car.

Like i said they dont put them in for a reason, Im sure that your not the first to have that idea. And somewhere someone has done it, and now they have less frends.

sLoWnStEaDy

02-02-2006, 11:25 PM

ive drivin a few high HP high TQ V8s. but i dont think its all that impressive. someone once said "you can teach a monkey to build a 500hp V8, but it takes talent to build a 500HP 4 cylinder" or something to that effect. someone on here said it a long time again and it stuck with me.

so what i hear you saying is an 8 second 1/4 mile in a V8 car would be more impressive than an 8 second run in a 4 cylinder car? Also i see those 4 banger cars launch jus as hard and fast as any V8. if two engines have the exact same HP and TQ what makes the one better just cause it has twice as many cylinders as the other?

Rollin on Dubs

02-03-2006, 12:49 AM

DragonUSMC

02-03-2006, 05:22 AM

Well I kinda agree both ways...

I say do it. If that’s what you want then do it… hot rodding has always been about “doing something that wasn’t ment to be done” and that fits right in ya know.

Rob and I are building a T-23 roadster and dropping the 383stroker into it. And we’ve had the same discussion a thousand times “how are we going to make ours different?” and its hard… If you think it hasn’t been done though, I’d have to bet you would be wrong. People are crazy so I’m sure someone’s done it at least once. Now have a lot of people done it? No, so that’s why I think it would be cool.

Remember its hot rodding… do what ever the fuck gives you a hard on! I mean you’re the one that has to build the damn thing so who cares what anyone else thinks.

Aephid

02-03-2006, 07:29 AM

You ask for opinions, so here's mine:
HOTRODS should be something of a sensory overload, Looks great, sounds great, runs great....just kinda makes you wanna lick it it's so good. A work of art on wheels...and fast. All this kinda leads us to a V8.

V8 pro.s:
1. They look good, are very pleasing to the eye
2. They are big, which to me is a good thing cause it would fill out alot of negative space in the front of the car
3. Exhaust tubes come in pairs of 4...perfect semetry for both sides of the car
4. Make alot of power, easier and more streetable than doing with a 4 cyl.. and if it's easier, then possibly cheaper as well, and would free up some time and budget to work on the rest of the car (cause lets face it...hotrods realy are ment to be beautiful as well as fast).
5. SOUND....chevy, ford, mopar, all sound great. The kind of rumble that makes girls panties all wet.

then you have the 4...
4cyl. pro.s:
1. fun new idea
2. props if it works well

So my opinion is that the 4cyl will look goofy, sound goofy, and possibly break the bank to do it well enough that goofy would be the only bad thing about it. Maybe you could do a rat rod with a 4 banger...those are more about speed than looks.
maybe if you wanted to do somthing new all together you could try stuffing a V8 into a honda.
or take a viper V10 and put it into a Shelby Cobra.
It just doesn't pan out to do a HOTROD with a 4banger (remember "my opinion")
I think if it's what you want to do that anything is possible, so go right ahead. If you do pull it off, some will hate it, some will wish they'd thought of it first...and you'd have my respect for doin' something completely new and unusual....but still think it looks goofy as hell.

Aephid

02-03-2006, 07:42 AM

i think the main thing here realy is that HOTROD can mean anything to anyone...it may be that you're hotrod is an oldschool american body wrapped around the heart of a honda...
should it realy matter that I (the die hard American muscle kinda guy) finds it a bit goofy to do it your way??

TbTalon94

02-03-2006, 09:12 AM

Well its cool that your trying to be different but have you ever built up a 4g63? If i remember right you gave up on your DSM because it was causing to many problems and draining your bank account. Do you even know what it involves making a 4g63 have 500-600 hp and have it reliable? Lets just say this:

-Fast, Cheap, Reliable........pick any two.

In the end Keith I don't think you have the knowledge (you could learn) or the money (dont know for sure) to complete that big of a project. The 4g63 is very tempramentle to many things. You have to have the right combination of parts and be very good at tuning if you want to bein the 500-600hp area. Not only that you need one hell of a stash of cash.

sLoWnStEaDy

02-03-2006, 09:39 AM

this is going to be (if i do it) a post Wyotech project. The main reason i sold my Talon isnt really because i couldnt fix it, it was because between that the fiero and the neon, non eof the three would ever get finished. i kept buying stuff for my talon that was not needed, but that i wanted, when i have two other cars that NEED stuff. so i had to get rid of one, and thats jus the one i chose. i already had the car apart and was pretty much to the point where i could replace the seal and drive it, but then i knew i would keep spending money on it, so the oil leak gave me a "reason" to get rid of it.

brown7

02-03-2006, 10:44 AM

Why not put these two together? now IMO that would be a HOT rod, specially if it was a hennesy TT......................

RWSBIRD

02-03-2006, 10:52 AM

Yeah that Willys would fly, definitely a hot rod.

logans dad

02-03-2006, 11:05 AM

If youve got lots of money would be nice but I would go with a V-8

69gt4speed

02-03-2006, 10:08 PM

Since you guys want to be different, why not do a turbo buick or some kind of turbo v8? I don't recall seeing any turbo street rod cars, they always have n/a or a 6-71 or 8-71.

RWSBIRD

02-06-2006, 08:36 PM

The Buick is a great idea. I could see an old Buick special with a 3.8 turbo and an overdrive tranny. It doesn't have 8 cylinders, it doesn't have a supercharger, but it would still be cool. It would make noise, roast tires, and it would go fast. Is that not what street rods are all about? Just imagine a Grand National GNX in 30's-40's metal.

boxmakingman

02-07-2006, 12:02 AM

All I know is that 4 bangers sound like shit.

rysbrnr

02-07-2006, 01:46 AM

All I know is that 4 bangers sound like sh*t.Werd.... I love the sound of my twin turbo V-6 over my single-turbo, external wastegated 4 banger.

gsxtacy

02-07-2006, 07:06 AM

Well with the 3.8 buick idea there is a yellow sedan delivery that runs around Iowa City that has one. He is almost always at the IC car shows if ya wanna check it out. There is also a metro with a 3.8 that runs down at Cordova ( watched it go a 9.2's). With the 4cyl idea there is a bonneville salt flat 32 Ford coupe that has a 2.4 SRT 4 engine in it, that has a write up in Hot Rod magazine.

Jared

TbTalon94

02-07-2006, 07:29 AM

[quote="boxmakingman";p="97136":8c8e2]All I know is that 4 bangers sound like sh*t.Werd.... I love the sound of my twin turbo V-6 over my single-turbo, external wastegated 4 banger.[/quote:8c8e2]

Well all of us can't be so fortunate.

Keith if you really want to do something good. Get a 1jz, or a 2jz and throw it in a hotrod. It could have gobs of power, they sounds fucking awesome, and it would be unique. They may be harder to find, more pricey, but the paybacks are worth it.

lenny

02-08-2006, 09:52 PM

If you do this make sure you change up your oil system. 4G63T motor or some FWD motor in general. You may cause oil-starvation to the cylinder under heavy acceleration/cornering. An easy way to fix that would be to switch over to a dry sump system (costs over a grand to do it correctly and a grand in this project that you're talking about is nothing but peanuts)
-Dan

lenny

02-08-2006, 10:01 PM

Oh, and I also happen to think that my 6 cylinder twin turbo sounds a hell of a lot better than my old turbo'd INTERNAL wastegated 4 shooter. Come to think of it I can't think of many obtainable cars (like a mustang, vette, or even a northstar V8) that sounds as good as a turbo'd 6 shooter. The Cobra motor is pretty sexy but it's not quite there I don't think. Go listen to Allgo's GN. Ever heard what a 2jz-gte supra sounds like when it's pushing boost? I think they sound a lot better than an 8 cylinder (now guys this is my opinion, don't get me wrong i'd love to rumble the drive through window with a 572). Anyways, both sound much much better than a 4 banger (unless that 4 banger happens to be a 4 rotor which is not really a "4 cylinder" or really "obtainable")....
-
Dan

BlownPony306

02-09-2006, 12:12 AM

-Fast, Cheap, Reliable........pick any two.

I like that! Not to mention it's true!

DEVOURER

02-09-2006, 12:52 PM

6 cylinders sound like shit too! ive never heard one that impressed me. i love the sound of a big cam in a v8. i want it to sound RAW!

TbTalon94

02-09-2006, 02:01 PM

Have you listened to a high horsepower Supra? Don't get me wrong, v8's sound awesome but a Supra and/or Skyline would take my vote in sound any day.

Rollin on Dubs

02-09-2006, 04:52 PM

6 cylinders sound like sh*t too! ive never heard one that impressed me. i love the sound of a big cam in a v8. i want it to sound RAW!

I dont think they sound that great either. Most turbo cars dont sound too tough either. (there are some exceptions) Torreys mustang sounded sick!

All i have to say is just build the damn thing and prove all the non belevers wrong.

tractioncontrol

02-09-2006, 09:41 PM

I like the sound of a v12 all the rest sound like shit. lol

tractioncontrol

02-09-2006, 09:42 PM

If your truck wasn't a whiny little bitch you would be able to hear the V8.

RWSBIRD

02-09-2006, 10:11 PM

Has anyone here ever heard a straight 8? That's hot rod material for sure.

DJ0820

02-10-2006, 03:50 PM

If you do this make sure you change up your oil system. 4G63T motor or some FWD motor in general. Most FWD motors are designed to sit horizontal. If you mount it with the crank linear to the frame (like in a RWD car) you may cause the front cylinder to suffer from oil starvation under heavy acceleration/cornering. An easy way to fix that would be to switch over to a dry sump system (costs over a grand to do it correctly and a grand in this project that you're talking about is nothing but peanuts)

You're kidding, right? How about a better baffled oil pan...as long as the pickup (which usually reaches to near the botton of the pan) is submerged, starvation isn't going to occur. I want to know where you are getting this info.

Besides, the 4G63 was offered in a RWD configuration from the factory for the trucks.

Anyways, on with this Retro rod.... throw a 2JZ-GTE or an RB26 in there. a twin turbo inline 6 would do nicely. there was a thread somewhere here with a 60's Stang with I think it was a 1JZ (TT inline6) in it

NitrousJunkie

02-12-2006, 07:23 PM

Build what makes you happy.
Dont build something just to be considered cool, thats just sad.

It would be cool to see something like that built......would I own it? Prolly Not, but if it makes you happy, do it.

There's alot of guys who have stuck v8's in rx7's, I'm still going to do the swap, I think it would be a very fun car if setup right, plus I would gain alot of experience building it.

Chris

lenny

02-15-2006, 11:08 PM

Here are some problems when using motors designed for FWD cars in RWD cars and vise-versa

http://www.autosafety.org/article.php?scid=149&did=964

http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/7177/3sgetransplant.html

good quote from the above article "The 3SGE motor normally slants about 15-20 degrees and in an upright FWD position does not drain the oil back from the heads as well as it should. SO pay careful attention to oiling.

To start, either modify the existing sump (these are one piece on early models, 2 piece on later models) or replace sump and oil pickup with pieces off 1S or 2S motor (ex Aussie & European ST140&ST141 Corona RWD circa 1982-85). This takes care of the slanted sump on the FWD 3SGE. Adding about 1" to the depth of the sump and oil pickup to hold extra oil ensures adequate oil remains in the sump. Some conversions have tapped into the side of the head to drain the trapped oil back into the sump via an external line. Also putting a baffle in the middle of the sump helps fix problems with the oil rushing away from the pickup under acceleration."

http://members.aol.com/solomiata/MX5Engine.html

Quote from above article "The 'K' engines are not designed for RWD and not only do the manifolds and plumbing not line up correctly for RWD but it will have oil starvation problems if used as such"

http://www.toysport.com/Technical%20Information/3sgt_tech_notes.htm

Quote from above "As mentioned earlier, oil delivery is crucial. Although the original transverse oil pan can be used, the pick-up and baffling is completely wrong. You have to get the correct RWD pan and oil pick-up, or risk losing the engine due to oiling problems. The late model engines have a higher output oil pump."

As I stated before a Dry sump system would fix these problems. You could also modify the sump tube on a FWD motor but why would you gigg-rigg a 30-100k hotrod when you could upgrade your oil system and solve a common problem at the same time?

boxmakingman

02-16-2006, 04:42 AM

hey guess what?
Your not gonna ever build a 4g63 RWD car

SO WHAT THE FUCK DOES IT MATTER?

lil krumm

02-16-2006, 07:24 AM

hey guess what?
Your not gonna ever build a 4g63 RWD car

SO WHAT THE f*ck DOES IT MATTER?

starion/comquest people do it.

boxmakingman

02-16-2006, 08:58 AM

[quote="boxmakingman";p="97978":59cdc]
hey guess what?
Your not gonna ever build a 4g63 RWD car

SO WHAT THE FUCK DOES IT MATTER?

starion/comquest people do it.[/quote:59cdc]

Yes BUT:
Does Lenny own a starion?
NO.
Does DJ? NO.
Will either of them own one in the future?
NO.

so it does not matter.

lil krumm

02-16-2006, 10:05 AM

[quote="lil murk";p="97979":66916][quote="boxmakingman";p="97978":66916]
hey guess what?
Your not gonna ever build a 4g63 RWD car

SO WHAT THE f*ck DOES IT MATTER?

starion/comquest people do it.[/quote:66916]

Yes BUT:
Does Lenny own a starion?
NO.
Does DJ? NO.
Will either of them own one in the future?
NO.

so it does not matter.
[/quote:66916]

i probably will, but does that matter...no

lol

lenny

02-16-2006, 11:03 AM

[quote="lil murk";p="97979":18454][quote="boxmakingman";p="97978":18454]
hey guess what?
Your not gonna ever build a 4g63 RWD car

SO WHAT THE f*ck DOES IT MATTER?

starion/comquest people do it.[/quote:18454]

Yes BUT:
Does Lenny own a starion?
NO.
Does DJ? NO.
Will either of them own one in the future?
NO.

so it does not matter.[/quote:18454]

My thought exactly!
-Dan

RWSBIRD

02-16-2006, 02:42 PM

How about an Acura 3.2L and late model 5-speed in an old roadster?

DJ0820

02-16-2006, 05:07 PM

Hm let's see here....

Failure to follow a proper oil-change schedule is "one of the most common causes" of engine "sludging," the company says.

thats a quote from the first link lenny posted.

good quote from the above article "The 3SGE motor normally slants about 15-20 degrees and in an upright FWD position does not drain the oil back from the heads as well as it should. SO pay careful attention to oiling.

ok, "in an upright FWD position does not drain the oil back from the heads as well as it should. " So it has oiling problems in a FWD setup?

After reviewing the other links, it seems there are some solutions to this problem, if you are even unfortunate enough to run into it.. Either install a different oil pan (better baffled as I stated much earlier), or in rare cases a different oil pickup as well. Converting to dry sump would just be throwing money at it when there are much easier solutions.

DustinsDuster

02-18-2006, 02:18 PM

if you decide to do it, i wouldnt use a 4g63 block, because you'll have an issue with motor mounts on the FWD block going RWD. you could use the transmission out of a 2.0L Mighty Max or Ram 50. i would say get the motor and transmission from a 2.0L Mitsu truck, throw a 4G63 DOHC head on it, and procede with the swap as you would swapping a turbo in one of the trucks.

Dustin