9/11/2001

[civicex_1134]

Ok, everybody's heard of Fahrenheit 9/11..... but i personally didnt like how that was set-up. I have saw this "other" movie a while back and didnt know what to think. I showed a few friends and they couldnt believe it either. I recently started showing more and more people, and am gettin mixed opinions. Now this video is 1hr20mins long, and im not gonna have you sit here and watch all of it, but just watch the first 10-15mins and see how you feel. Ive done a lil research on the movie and i do know that these are all FACTS that anybody could find. These people are just the only ones to have the balls to publish them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu_6_PvSbg4&list=PL6D706DB0775D443D&index=1&feature=plpp_video

[black88gt]

O god where is whats his name. We already have a go-to conspiracy theorist on IAF.

[Deimos]

Trevor

[civicex_1134]

just an opinion, thought id share.... LOL

[LT1Dan]

Jesus. You could have at least told us it was the "Loose Change" bullshit before I clicked it. Learn to use the embed tags.

I'm not going to watch what you linked but I'm sure this article will answer some of their "facts".
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military/news/1230517

Read up.

[civicex_1134]

dont get me wrong, ive read both sides and facts about this and facts about that. Im just gonna stick with what i truly believe, lol. this is gonna get at least 10 pages!

[LT1Dan]

So you think the US Government blew up the WTC?

[civicex_1134]

yup...

[LT1Dan]

Why do you believe that? Why would they do you think they would want to?

[Deimos]

Cuz hondas are gay duh

[civicex_1134]

because of that video i just posted. To YOU, its dumb and stupid... To ME, its proof... Its what i believe. just wanted to share lol

[civicex_1134]

Cuz hondas are gay duh

DUH! shit where have you been?

[Deimos]

DUH! shit where have you been?

I have been reading the links Dan posted.

[civicex_1134]

you must read slow.... lol. Ive seen a lot of those articles tho.

[Deimos]

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military/news/debunking-911-myths-pentagon#bigplane

[Deimos]

you must read slow.... lol. Ive seen a lot of those articles tho.

So you know that dude ws ripping on ya huh?

[civicex_1134]

cool link bro... lol. i already told u, u wont change my mind. thats not why i posted the video, i wanted peoples opinion on the video, not their opinion on why i and/or other people should change their minds. but go on.... im listening

[Deimos]

meh http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChjyCR8V2Bg

[civicex_1134]

dude you dont even know..... THAT BOAT STRAIGHT DISAPPEARED!!! lol, forgot about that shit

[LT1Dan]

Well, my opinion is that the video is shit and most of it has been proven to be false be REAL experts, not people looking for a conspiracy. If you choose to believe it than, whatever. Thanks for letting us know for future reference on your opinions.

[Deimos]

damn labradoodles

[civicex_1134]

god damn Dan, so your gonna tell me that ur opinion about me changed? SHOCKING! lol.

[civicex_1134]

damn labradoodles

I know right.... they ruin everything!

[JustinS]

You should get cold clocked in the mouth by a navy seal for believing that shit... Just like Jesse Ventura lol.

[civicex_1134]

:)

[Clinical]

I believe WTC was an inside job...


















































































done by jedi

[derek072887]

my uncle is a huge theorist.... he also believes the Kennedy assassination was an inside job.. even has some video showing the driver of his limo turning around and pointing a gun at Kennedy...

[Domestic Disturbance]

cool link bro... lol. i already told u, u wont change my mind. thats not why i posted the video, i wanted peoples opinion on the video, not their opinion on why i and/or other people should change their minds. but go on.... im listening

I think because you chose to show your opinion on this, people will reflect their opinions towards you. They aren't going to all stand on a soap box and say "well I believe...".

Also, saying you wont change my mind is a silly stance to take. Why were you so open to sway your opinion towards this theory, yet unwilling to give the opposition fair weight in its rebuttal?

My opinion, I find most of those pretty shallow and mostly capture fantasy and awe. Nothing with really incriminating evidence that would help out weigh one big thing. Why blow up the World Trade Centers and risk economic pitfalls afterwards? There could be several different ways to spark war without endangering the precious economy.

[85XR7Project]

So the US Gov wanted to hit the Pentagon as well?

[FiFdYnUtZ]

Dallas is as ignorant in his beliefs as he is with automotive performance..

[LT1Dan]

god damn Dan, so your gonna tell me that ur opinion about me changed? SHOCKING! lol.

Don't flatter yourself. I've never thought that highly of you.


So the US Gov wanted to hit the Pentagon as well?

They shot a missile at the Pentagon to make it look like they weren't behind it. At least that is what I expect the answer to be.

[Caleb]

Why do you believe that? Why would they do you think they would want to?

Not to just defend Dallas, but to enlighten people on this subject of doubting the government. It's because they have the capability of carrying out their proposals such as (Operation Norhtwoods)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods, which could have correlated into a 9/11 but in the 60's or 70's. I used to not have a doubt of my government until I had read this document in its entirety. If someone is capable of proposing such legislation to suggest we attack our own people or set scenario's up for us to invade other countries under false pretenses. I've posted about this before a long time ago.


In response to a request for pretexts for military intervention by the Chief of Operations of the Cuba Project, Brig. Gen. Edward Lansdale, the document listed methods, and outlined plans, that the authors believed would garner public and international support for U.S. military intervention in Cuba. These were to be staged attacks purported to be of Cuban origin.

Since it would seem desirable to use legitimate provocation as the basis for US military intervention in Cuba a cover and deception plan, to include requisite preliminary actions such as has been developed in response to Task 33 c, could be executed as an initial effort to provoke Cuban reactions. Harassment plus deceptive actions to convince the Cubans of imminent invasion would be emphasized. Our military posture throughout execution of the plan will allow a rapid change from exercise to intervention if Cuban response justifies.
A series of well coordinated incidents will be planned to take place in and around Guantanamo to give genuine appearance of being done by hostile Cuban forces.

a. Incidents to establish a credible attack (not in chronological order):
Start rumors (many). Use clandestine radio.
Land friendly Cubans in uniform "over-the-fence" to stage attack on base.
Capture Cuban (friendly) saboteurs inside the base.
Start riots near the base main gate (friendly Cubans).[14]
Blow up ammunition inside the base; start fires.
Burn aircraft on air base (sabotage).
Lob mortar shells from outside of base into base. Some damage to installations.
Capture assault teams approaching from the sea or vicinity of Guantanamo City.
Capture militia group which storms the base.
Sabotage ship in harbor; large fires—napthalene.
Sink ship near harbor entrance. Conduct funerals for mock-victims (may be in lieu of (10)).
b. United States would respond by executing offensive operations to secure water and power supplies, destroying artillery and mortar emplacements which threaten the base.
c. Commence large scale United States military operations.

A "Remember the Maine" incident could be arranged in several forms:

a. We could blow up a US ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba.
b. We could blow up a drone (unmanned) vessel anywhere in the Cuban waters. We could arrange to cause such incident in the vicinity of Havana or Santiago as a spectacular result of Cuban attack from the air or sea, or both. The presence of Cuban planes or ships merely investigating the intent of the vessel could be fairly compelling evidence that the ship was taken under attack. The nearness to Havana or Santiago would add credibility especially to those people that might have heard the blast or have seen the fire. The US could follow up with an air/sea rescue operation covered by US fighters to "evacuate" remaining members of the non-existent crew. Casualty lists in US newspapers would cause a helpful wave of national indignation.

We could develop a Communist Cuban terror campaign in the Miami area, in other Florida cities and even in Washington.[15]
The terror campaign could be pointed at refugees seeking haven in the United States. We could sink a boatload of Cubans en route to Florida (real or simulated). We could foster attempts on lives of Cuban refugees in the United States even to the extent of wounding in instances to be widely publicized. Exploding a few plastic bombs in carefully chosen spots, the arrest of Cuban agents and the release of prepared documents substantiating Cuban involvement, also would be helpful in projecting the idea of an irresponsible government.
A "Cuban-based, Castro-supported" filibuster could be simulated against a neighboring Caribbean nation (in the vein of the 14 June invasion of the Dominican Republic). We know that Castro is backing subversive efforts clandestinely against Haiti, Dominican Republic, Guatemala, and Nicaragua at present and possible others. These efforts can be magnified and additional ones contrived for exposure. For example, advantage can be taken of the sensitivity of the Dominican Air Force to intrusions within their national air space. "Cuban" B-26 or C-46 type aircraft could make cane-burning raids at night. Soviet Bloc incendiaries could be found. This could be coupled with "Cuban" messages to the Communist underground in the Dominican Republic and "Cuban" shipments of arm which would be found, or intercepted, on the beach.
Use of MIG type aircraft by US pilots could provide additional provocation. Harassment of civil air, attacks on surface shipping and destruction of US military drone aircraft by MIG type planes would be useful as complementary actions. An F-86 properly painted would convince air passengers that they saw a Cuban MIG, especially if the pilot of the transport were to announce such fact. The primary drawback to this suggestion appears to be the security risk inherent in obtaining or modifying an aircraft. However, reasonable copies of the MIG could be produced from US resources in about three months.[16]
Hijacking attempts against civil air and surface craft should appear to continue as harassing measures condoned by the government of Cuba. Concurrently, genuine defections of Cuban civil and military air and surface craft should be encouraged.
It is possible to create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner en route from the United States to Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama or Venezuela. The destination would be chosen only to cause the flight plan route to cross Cuba. The passengers could be a group of college students off on a holiday or any grouping of persons with a common interest to support chartering a non-scheduled flight.

a. An aircraft at Eglin AFB would be painted and numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered aircraft belonging to a CIA proprietary organization in the Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be substituted for the actual civil aircraft and would be loaded with the selected passengers, all boarded under carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered aircraft would be converted to a drone.
b. Take off times of the drone aircraft and the actual aircraft will be scheduled to allow a rendezvous south of Florida. From the rendezvous point the passenger-carrying aircraft will descend to minimum altitude and go directly into an auxiliary field at Eglin AFB where arrangements will have been made to evacuate the passengers and return the aircraft to its original status. The drone aircraft meanwhile will continue to fly the filed flight plan. When over Cuba the drone will begin transmitting on the international distress frequency a "MAY DAY" message stating he is under attack by Cuban MIG aircraft. The transmission will be interrupted by destruction of the aircraft which will be triggered by radio signal. This will allow ICAO radio[17] stations in the Western Hemisphere to tell the US what has happened to the aircraft instead of the US trying to "sell" the incident.

It is possible to create an incident which will make it appear that Communist Cuban MIGs have destroyed a USAF aircraft over international waters in an unprovoked attack.

a. Approximately 4 or 5 F-101 aircraft will be dispatched in trail from Homestead AFB, Florida, to the vicinity of Cuba. Their mission will be to reverse course and simulate fakir aircraft for an air defense exercise in southern Florida. These aircraft would conduct variations of these flights at frequent Intervals. Crews would be briefed to remain at least 12 miles off the Cuban coast; however, they would be required to carry live ammunition in the event that hostile actions were taken by the Cuban MIGs.
b. On one such flight, a pre-briefed pilot would fly tail-end Charley at considerable interval between aircraft. While near the Cuban Island this pilot would broadcast that he had been jumped by MIGs and was going down. No other calls would be made. The pilot would then fly directly west at extremely low altitude and land at a secure base, an Eglin auxiliary. The aircraft would be met by the proper people, quickly stored and given a new tail number. The pilot who had performed the mission under an alias, would resume his proper identity and return to his normal place of business. The pilot and aircraft would then have disappeared.
c. At precisely the same time that the aircraft was presumably shot down, a submarine or small surface craft would disburse F-101 parts, parachute, etc., at approximately 15 to 20 miles off the Cuban coast and depart. The pilots returning to Homestead would have a true story as far as they knew. Search ships and aircraft could be dispatched and parts of aircraft found.[18]

[Caleb]

James Bamford wrote on Northwoods:

Operation Northwoods, which had the written approval of the Chairman and every member of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, called for innocent people to be shot on American streets; for boats carrying refugees fleeing Cuba to be sunk on the high seas; for a wave of violent terrorism to be launched in Washington, D.C., Miami, and elsewhere. People would be framed for bombings they did not commit; planes would be hijacked. Using phony evidence, all of it would be blamed on Castro, thus giving Lemnitzer and his cabal the excuse, as well as the public and international backing, they needed to launch their war.[19]

The fact of the matter is, we'll never know exactly what happened that day. The fact that they found traces of nano-thermite in the ashes from the building's was a little hairy. You wouldn't normally expect to find traces of nano-thermite anywhere in downtown New York. Again, this could turn into a 10 page debate, but as I said, we'll never know exactly what happened that day in truths entirety.

[Caleb]

http://www.benthamscience.com/open/tocpj/articles/V002/7TOCPJ.pdf peer reviewed study over the nano-thermite. Not all experts have believed the real 9/11 story, just including this as a control. Some people like evidence, some like theoretics.

[Stutz]

http://www.debunking911.com/thermite.htm

[Caleb]

I watched the first couple of minutes of the video and just realized they touched base with the above Operation Northwoods I had mentioned. It is what it is.

[Caleb]

http://www.debunking911.com/thermite.htm

That article doesn't debunk the actual evidence found of NANO-thermite found at the site, but just debunks that standard thermite could have been used to cut the beams using. Not to mention the article I posted was a long conducted study that went all the way and published on 2009 (after the fact of the 2 studies produced in that above link) with some pretty interesting evidence in the peer reviewed article that suggests the materials they found were not standard thermite, but something smaller and less incendiary with just as much, if not more energy.

[Deimos]

Dude thermite is the shit.

[civicex_1134]

Don't flatter yourself. I've never thought that highly of you.



Dallas is as ignorant in his beliefs as he is with automotive performance..


These are completely uncalled for! Fuck both of you... Ive NEVER, said anything like this to either of you. You both come out to the races, and ive got along great with both of you. Dan, ive been to your house and hungout with you. And Tyler, your the one whos always callin me when you come to town. You both basically just told me that your 2-faced as shit! The things i say online are completely not deliberate and am just giving you shit.... All i can say is WOW!

[FiFdYnUtZ]

ha.....ha....

















ha

[Clinical]

These are completely uncalled for! Fuck both of you... Ive NEVER, said anything like this to either of you. You both come out to the races, and ive got along great with both of you. Dan, ive been to your house and hungout with you. And Tyler, your the one whos always callin me when you come to town. You both basically just told me that your 2-faced as shit! The things i say online are completely not deliberate and am just giving you shit.... All i can say is WOW!

oh jeeze

http://i1159.photobucket.com/albums/p627/trollfaces11/fuck-yeah-clean.png

[FiFdYnUtZ]

I just have a hard time listening to peoples conspiracy bullshit that pretty much discredits and dishonors the thousands of innocent victims, families, firefighters, and policemen involved...let alone the men and women in service out protecting your punkass right to live free...there is a lot of Shit wrong with our government, but imposing your opinion that they would be responsible is disrespectful in every way to the people who make our country what it is

[LT1Dan]

I understand why the government, theoretically, may want to do something like this. My question was mostly directed at Dallas to see if he could give me an opinion that wasn't quoted directly from the video.

Operation Northwoods is definitely an interesting look into what the government is capable of planning. I don't think there is a way for the government to prove to truthers that they weren't involved because they will always have their doubts. I'm just glad no one used the word "sheeple" in this discussion.

549


These are completely uncalled for! Fuck both of you... Ive NEVER, said anything like this to either of you. You both come out to the races, and ive got along great with both of you. Dan, ive been to your house and hungout with you. And Tyler, your the one whos always callin me when you come to town. You both basically just told me that your 2-faced as shit! The things i say online are completely not deliberate and am just giving you shit.... All i can say is WOW!

You've been to my house once, I think, when I had 20~ people over for a party. I wouldn't exactly call that "hanging out". Sorry that you thought we were best buds or something. See you at the street "races".

[Deimos]

You've been to my house once, I think, when I had 20~ people over for a party. I wouldn't exactly call that "hanging out". Sorry that you thought we were best buds or something. See you at the street "races".

So what you have a party and didn't even invite me? Now you don't answer your text message. OH lordy its the end of the world.

[LT1Dan]

So what you have a party and didn't even invite me? Now you don't answer your text message. OH lordy its the end of the world.

Nah, thats not until December.

[civicex_1134]

You've been to my house once, I think, when I had 20~ people over for a party. I wouldn't exactly call that "hanging out". Sorry that you thought we were best buds or something. See you at the street "races".

Actually been to your house 3 times, but its fine. And i didnt think we were "best buds".... I guess i just had a lil more respect for you than you did me. But i guess thats how everyone is. face to face its, "oh hey whats up, how u been. whats good.... etc etc" But online its, "i never really liked you all that much." James has said this a million times: "i dont get why people hate you so much... you dont talk shit, you dont run your mouth, and you pretty much stay to yourself." Do me a favor, this goes to every fake mother fucker on here, next time you see me if you dont like me then dont talk to me, tell me to fuck off, tell me go else where. Dont be fake and act like your a friend just to save face.

[FiFdYnUtZ]

I've said it a million times that I like you Dallas I just find a majority of your opinions wrong lol

[Clinical]

"i dont get why people hate you so much... you dont talk shit, you dont run your mouth, and you pretty much stay to yourself."

Aside from your horribly narrow view where the only cars worth anything is hondas, and half the time you can't seem to take constructive criticism.

Don't get me wrong, I love hondas, maybe even more than some v8's. I just have a broad horizon, I understand what can make power, and what platforms have more potential than other platforms.
You just have plain outright told people their cars are gay and shitty compared to hondas/acuras. We try to get you to understand how bad of a choice a turbo with a 6000rpm spool is for a 300~whp street car compared to a more efficient street turbo, and you flip shit.

+When you're asking for people's opinions on your rep as a honda guy, and you get them and there are some opinions/reasoning that aren't good - you start mouthing off to them, for example telling boostedsohc how his car isnt impressive, etc etc.

I don't know you personally, but this is just what I've seen from this forum. I doubt you've ever walked up to the fbody/mustang guys here face to face and said "your car is gay as fuck"
I'm sure I'll run into you though eventually, with the way I've been going to CR meets here and there.

I don't think people hate you, they just get annoyed/tired of the way you act sometimes.

[85XR7Project]

Lol this shit is hilarious.

[Caleb]

I just have a hard time listening to peoples conspiracy bullshit that pretty much discredits and dishonors the thousands of innocent victims, families, firefighters, and policemen involved...let alone the men and women in service out protecting your punkass right to live free...there is a lot of Shit wrong with our government, but imposing your opinion that they would be responsible is disrespectful in every way to the people who make our country what it is

The problem I have with this statement, people regurgitate all the time that "the soldiers = fighting in Afghanistan and Iraq = protecting our freedoms at home" which is the most utmost bullshit, simply because its not true. If you've barely done your research enough, this is hardly the case. I respect the honest soldiers and commands, but not everyone the military. They sign up for the military to perform a job, that's it and that's how a lot of soldiers feel about it, they don't need to be praised or having people speak up for them. This opinion has come from military personnel I have had or seen conversations with. You want to talk about protecting freedoms? Rewind back to WW2 when War was declared and actually meant something. We had a tragedy in 9/11, no doubt. However the media never mentions the tragedies that happen in Iraq: Innocent civilians being questioned and murdered for no reason by power tripping soldiers, media officials taking friendly fire from American tanks/apaches, whole families getting killed on accident by poorly planned missile strikes, our own Shell Shocked soldiers being tortured physically and mentally by other superior officers while in a "time out" confinement. Lots and lots of fucked up stories. Over 100,000+ Innocent Iraqi's killed fighting bullshit "terrorism".

Imposing that they would/could be responsible is probable and not out of the question and I personally don't think its disrespectful one bit to the people "who make our country what it is". The governments capabilities and proposals suggest so. So is it okay to doubt your government? Absolutely. I don't think half of you guys understand that keeping this normalcy bias towards the government as if they are all innocent is actually a bad mentality to have. The government is not as transparent as you think it is. Amongst other factors(people making up a lot of shit with no fact based support, government not admitting something that's factually plausible), a lot of conspiracies are products of the governments own secrecy. No one will truthfully know what happened that day, so I would let it go.

[stangvortech]

The problem I have with this statement, people regurgitate all the time that "the soldiers = fighting in Afghanistan and Iraq = protecting our freedoms at home" which is the most utmost bullshit, simply because its not true. If you've barely done your research enough, this is hardly the case. I respect the honest soldiers and commands, but not everyone the military. They sign up for the military to perform a job, that's it and that's how a lot of soldiers feel about it, they don't need to be praised or having people speak up for them. This opinion has come from military personnel I have had or seen conversations with. You want to talk about protecting freedoms? Rewind back to WW2 when War was declared and actually meant something. We had a tragedy in 9/11, no doubt. However the media never mentions the tragedies that happen in Iraq: Innocent civilians being questioned and murdered for no reason by power tripping soldiers, media officials taking friendly fire from American tanks/apaches, whole families getting killed on accident by poorly planned missile strikes, our own Shell Shocked soldiers being tortured physically and mentally by other superior officers while in a "time out" confinement. Lots and lots of fucked up stories. Over 100,000+ Innocent Iraqi's killed fighting bullshit "terrorism".

Imposing that they would/could be responsible is probable and not out of the question and I personally don't think its disrespectful one bit to the people "who make our country what it is". The governments capabilities and proposals suggest so. So is it okay to doubt your government? Absolutely. I don't think half of you guys understand that keeping this normalcy bias towards the government as if they are all innocent is actually a bad mentality to have. The government is not as transparent as you think it is. Amongst other factors(people making up a lot of shit with no fact based support, government not admitting something that's factually plausible), a lot of conspiracies are products of the governments own secrecy. No one will truthfully know what happened that day, so I would let it go.

The amount of fucking stupidly in your post is mind blowing!
How are they not protecting our freedoms buy catching the guys that admitted to and carried out 9/11? Setting up a non-corrupt gov and letting the citizens be free and vote and setting up a good military? The military is not a job it is SERVING YOUR COUNTRY. I’m not going to get going any more in to these kind of post or threads. your a idiot and that is a fact.

[85XR7Project]

I get what he's saying. The men during WWII did fight for OUR freedom, the men and women in Iraq and Afghanistan are doing a great thing but setting up a government there doesn't exactly effect our freedoms. Overthrowing Saddam was a good thing but that was us playing world police as usual. Its nice to know we got Bin Laden after 9/11 and everything but there comes a point where you have to think to yourself "what are we over there fighting?" This is a terrorist organization, they have no country or affiliation, they have no fear of death, when one leader gets killed another anonymous one steps in and plans terrible shit like the last one.

Now I don't want to invalidate what our troops are doing, they are doing a job and it IS a noble one. It isn't easy to create a government out of nothing. I just get irritated when people say they are fighting for OUR freedom, they are fighting for Iraqi/Afghani freedom. These people have been oppressed for so long and have had a corrupt government for ages, this is more for them than us. The only gain WE got was a little payback on Saddam/Bin Laden.

[AutoMods]

There are too many people rotating in and out of the government to keep secrets. Congress is always rotating members and the president can change every 4 years. Government is pretty random, nobody can predict who is going to office. You have guys that come out of nowhere like Rick Santorum has recently.

Conspiracy theorists are pretty gullible imho

[Caleb]

The amount of fucking stupidly in your post is mind blowing!
How are they not protecting our freedoms buy catching the guys that admitted to and carried out 9/11? Setting up a non-corrupt gov and letting the citizens be free and vote and setting up a good military? The military is not a job it is SERVING YOUR COUNTRY. I’m not going to get going any more in to these kind of post or threads. your a idiot and that is a fact.

It's "You're an" but any who..

I was very hesitant to post what I did because I was afraid people were going to get butt hurt over it and I was right. You need to understand and realize that not everyone that joins the service is specifically joining to "wanting to serve". A lot of people join the military for many reasons: Need a direction in life, Free Schooling, Pursuing a career specifically in the military, joining due to family tradition of serving. Just like I stated my opinion as well as other service members also had the same thoughts and feelings that they join to do a job to reap the benefits of joining. YES some join to serve just to serve, but a there's quite a few who don't. My little brother is in the Navy and he chose to join the Navy because he wanted a direction in life and on top of that he gets free schooling. He's currently furthering his military training to eventually become a police officer when he gets out. That's what he wanted to do and I respect that as much I miss the little mouthy bastard.

I didn't post what I did to get called an idiot or ridiculed, just to state and share the realistic side of what was being said at hand. A huge problem in America is people refusing to be realistic anymore with stuff.

A lot of people are under the assumption were over in those countries liberating them and instilling a government which is partially true. However these governments we set up have US interests in mind. Small minor example: When we had gotten a government presence established back in Iraq in 2003 after the invasion, shortly after we had re-established the Oil Currency back to the Dollar from the Euro. A lot of people missed out on that interesting fact and don't realize how important the Oil-Dollar relationship is to the U.S. Economy. Just a little history/prediction run down to show the trends that's been going on for people who are oblivious to this shit.

Back in 2000, Sadaam had switched the Oil for food Currency from the Dollar to the Euro. A year later 9/11 happened. The fear mongering of the media with the terrorist threat meter and consistent terrorist threats and talks were going on. The main false pretense that lead up to the conflict in Iraq such : Claims of Saddam harboring WMD's. And the other partially true ones of Iraq containing Al Queda members. So we invaded in 2003 and made it clear we needed to take out "Al Queda" forces as well as "liberate" the Iraqi people from a terrible regime as this was the public's understanding. Shortly after we invaded and had a U.S. interest based government installed onto the Iraqi's they changed the Oil currency from Euro to the Dollar. Keep that in mind. We kept fighting the "terrorists" and eliminating "terrorist" leaders while "liberating" the people. In the mean time we have killed over 100,000+ Iraqi Civilians, 50%+ of them are women and children that have died. This isn't including life altering injuries either. Aside from the shameful statistics for the end the Iraq "war". Look at history slowly repeating its self with Iran. Iran is wanting to go nuclear, the media is doing its usual talking points and fear mongering of suggesting that Iran maybe developing WMD's when you've had reports of CIA members saying this isn't the case. On top of this, Iran has switched its Oil currencies to gold and other due to the embargo's/sanctions placed on them by the United States. Its just a trend I've noticed and that some people have said to pay attention to and its interesting. Starts with countries switching oil currencies from the dollar and then invasion on our part due to potential false pretenses/fear mongering to get public support.

From my understanding of what I've read from economists experts have said. The Oil-Dollar relationship is huge to the United States because it allows us to accrue such a large debt and recycle the dollars spent on oil back into the U.S. economy/OPEC because of the relevancy that majority of manufacturing/automotive countries NEED Dollars to buy oil for manufacturing, gas, etc. The problem with that is, were placing trust in the Oil Subsidy countries (Iraq, Iran, Venezuela, Syria, Saudi Arabia etc.) to keep the Oil Currency in the Dollar. The prediction and reaction would be if all the countries wised up and go out of the dollar and sold their oil for another currency: The dollar would devalue significantly, countries would start dumping their devaluing dollars(china's already doing this currently) for other basket currencies for oil/trade. Which in turn would de-rank the dollar as the global relevant currency and cause mass hyper inflation to our U.S. Economy and prices would skyrocket and this is what a lot of people are fearing while mixing that with the out of control spending on the military spelunking over seas.

Time will tell on all of that but its something to keep an eye on to see how it plays out.

[Caleb]

There are too many people rotating in and out of the government to keep secrets. Congress is always rotating members and the president can change every 4 years. Government is pretty random, nobody can predict who is going to office. You have guys that come out of nowhere like Rick Santorum has recently.

Conspiracy theorists are pretty gullible imho

Some of them are, facts are your friends though. However I can almost guarantee there is an overwhelming amount of ignorant people that don't know shit about their government or political policies when it comes to the general public vs conspiracy theorists. One of my pet peeves thought about the phrase "conspiracy theorists", the phrase comes with automatic negative attention in today's light which I think to say is unfair. However there are people who are just off the wall with no facts to support a case regarding something lol.

[Chase]

There are a lot of good points made from everyone, but along with those come a bunch of stupid insults driven by emotion.

Why doesn't everybody just stop posting. From a 3rd party you all look dumb.

[Batwood]

There are a lot of good points made from everyone, but along with those come a bunch of stupid insults driven by emotion.

Why doesn't everybody just stop posting. From a 3rd party you all look dumb.

What he said^
Emotions shouldn't be allowed on the internet.

[Caleb]

There are a lot of good points made from everyone, but along with those come a bunch of stupid insults driven by emotion.

Why doesn't everybody just stop posting. From a 3rd party you all look dumb.

My opinion is that you have no right to your opinion. And emotions are for women and gay people. /troll.

[SledgeWS6]

I just have a hard time listening to peoples conspiracy bullshit that pretty much discredits and dishonors the thousands of innocent victims, families, firefighters, and policemen involved...let alone the men and women in service out protecting your punkass right to live free...there is a lot of Shit wrong with our government, but imposing your opinion that they would be responsible is disrespectful in every way to the people who make our country what it is

Could not have said it any better. You live in the best country on the planet and that is not an opinion, that is fact. The idea somebody can even think something like this up is testament to that. Shit happens, people don't like us. We have not been attacked on our own soil since we became a super-power on the international stage. Yes, we became ignorant, we learned.
When you voice your opinion on a public forum, you best be ready for agreeance and retaliation, especially with a subject as sensitive as this. Could the government do something this, probably. Would they? I highly doubt it with ever fiber of my being.

[Caleb]

Could not have said it any better. You live in the best country on the planet and that is not an opinion, that is fact.

No offense Tyler, but that is a straight opinionated. No way around it lol come on son. Just saying. I'll agree we have it better in this country than many others, but to bluntly say its the best, is just pure opinionated.

[SledgeWS6]

No offense Tyler, but that is a straight opinionated. No way around it lol come on son. Just saying. I'll agree we have it better in this country than many others, but to bluntly say its the best, is just pure opinionated.

I'll just reference the Constitution to back up my claims. :outtahere:

[derek072887]

go ahead and reference that constitution we don't follow it anyway...

[stangvortech]

It's "You're an" but any who..

I was very hesitant to post what I did because I was afraid people were going to get butt hurt over it and I was right. You need to understand and realize that not everyone that joins the service is specifically joining to "wanting to serve". A lot of people join the military for many reasons: Need a direction in life, Free Schooling, Pursuing a career specifically in the military, joining due to family tradition of serving. Just like I stated my opinion as well as other service members also had the same thoughts and feelings that they join to do a job to reap the benefits of joining. YES some join to serve just to serve, but a there's quite a few who don't. My little brother is in the Navy and he chose to join the Navy because he wanted a direction in life and on top of that he gets free schooling. He's currently furthering his military training to eventually become a police officer when he gets out. That's what he wanted to do and I respect that as much I miss the little mouthy bastard.

I didn't post what I did to get called an idiot or ridiculed, just to state and share the realistic side of what was being said at hand. A huge problem in America is people refusing to be realistic anymore with stuff.

A lot of people are under the assumption were over in those countries liberating them and instilling a government which is partially true. However these governments we set up have US interests in mind. Small minor example: When we had gotten a government presence established back in Iraq in 2003 after the invasion, shortly after we had re-established the Oil Currency back to the Dollar from the Euro. A lot of people missed out on that interesting fact and don't realize how important the Oil-Dollar relationship is to the U.S. Economy. Just a little history/prediction run down to show the trends that's been going on for people who are oblivious to this shit.

Back in 2000, Sadaam had switched the Oil for food Currency from the Dollar to the Euro. A year later 9/11 happened. The fear mongering of the media with the terrorist threat meter and consistent terrorist threats and talks were going on. The main false pretense that lead up to the conflict in Iraq such : Claims of Saddam harboring WMD's. And the other partially true ones of Iraq containing Al Queda members. So we invaded in 2003 and made it clear we needed to take out "Al Queda" forces as well as "liberate" the Iraqi people from a terrible regime as this was the public's understanding. Shortly after we invaded and had a U.S. interest based government installed onto the Iraqi's they changed the Oil currency from Euro to the Dollar. Keep that in mind. We kept fighting the "terrorists" and eliminating "terrorist" leaders while "liberating" the people. In the mean time we have killed over 100,000+ Iraqi Civilians, 50%+ of them are women and children that have died. This isn't including life altering injuries either. Aside from the shameful statistics for the end the Iraq "war". Look at history slowly repeating its self with Iran. Iran is wanting to go nuclear, the media is doing its usual talking points and fear mongering of suggesting that Iran maybe developing WMD's when you've had reports of CIA members saying this isn't the case. On top of this, Iran has switched its Oil currencies to gold and other due to the embargo's/sanctions placed on them by the United States. Its just a trend I've noticed and that some people have said to pay attention to and its interesting. Starts with countries switching oil currencies from the dollar and then invasion on our part due to potential false pretenses/fear mongering to get public support.

From my understanding of what I've read from economists experts have said. The Oil-Dollar relationship is huge to the United States because it allows us to accrue such a large debt and recycle the dollars spent on oil back into the U.S. economy/OPEC because of the relevancy that majority of manufacturing/automotive countries NEED Dollars to buy oil for manufacturing, gas, etc. The problem with that is, were placing trust in the Oil Subsidy countries (Iraq, Iran, Venezuela, Syria, Saudi Arabia etc.) to keep the Oil Currency in the Dollar. The prediction and reaction would be if all the countries wised up and go out of the dollar and sold their oil for another currency: The dollar would devalue significantly, countries would start dumping their devaluing dollars(china's already doing this currently) for other basket currencies for oil/trade. Which in turn would de-rank the dollar as the global relevant currency and cause mass hyper inflation to our U.S. Economy and prices would skyrocket and this is what a lot of people are fearing while mixing that with the out of control spending on the military spelunking over seas.

Time will tell on all of that but its something to keep an eye on to see how it plays out.


The only one that is not realistic here is you. Welcome to the internet. I still think your a idiot on your views. Yes, my post was emotional and I had a few beers beforehand with some friends. I don’t care what people think of me. I don’t care what the reason is people join the military. The fact is they are serving our country and have the high possibility of putting their life on the line and not making it home. It is not 8-5 and you go home every night that is a job. I sure as hell hope they have US interest in mind when setting up the government. I don’t care about the oil to dollar ratio if they changed it and it lowered the price of oil I’m fine with it. We need to be getting oil here and putting in the Keystone pipe line. It does not matter what the "reason" is we went to war. We went to war and accomplished a lot and did 5x the amount of good than bad. Yea, people died it was a WAR that’s what happens when you go to war. When The US goes to war it is for the good not the bad. I think we have enough problems here at home to fix before we go fixing the world’s problems and starting any more wars. You are looking at the glass half empty. On the dollar it is not backed up by anything any more like it once was with gold. In the end shit is going to hit the fan. I would say 5ish years if not before we will have a Greece type situation. The dollar is not worth much anymore anyway and it is not due to military spending it is due to us pissing way too much money down the drain here in the United States and else ware. If we had a conservative government the whole time we would not be in this situation of large debt with stupid government programs like social security, welfare, unemployment and the big joke is Obama care.

[Caleb]

I'll just reference the Constitution to back up my claims. :outtahere:

The fact that you've only resided in USA I would assume, for 100% of your life would be a bias analysis making it an opinionated answer. Opinions don't = truth in this case. But again, we are lucky to be living in a decent country, where we don't have to go to bed scared wondering whats gonna happen to us in the middle of the night.

Despite me possibly looking like an asshole and pissing off some people and shining a different light on some subjects and being childishly insulted by Stangvortech, I still have nothing against the guy. I in fact, have nothing against anyone on this site frankly (unless you've gotten a bad rep from stealing or some shit). I however, don't have an issue responding and calling out bullshit on dumbass "false narrow minded" opinions and stuff when I see it. But that's just me, If I am wrong on something, I will admit it when I am proven wrong. Only helps further build my knowledge and character being corrected in that way. Just like what's his nuts with the Red GTP here on the forums now. I learned some stuff about the GTP's because I was corrected by someone who had experience with em.

Sledge aka Tyler, decent guy in person.
Civicex aka Dallas, decent guy in person.
Fiddy aka Tyler C, decent guy in person.
Jacob S aka JSherm, decent guy in person.
JustinS aka JSherm#2, decent guy in person.

You know what, I actually think they are all decent people when it comes down to it. I don't know their opinions of me but its whatev's. I don't know a lot of people on the rest of this site, and probably wouldn't mind meeting more people on here as well.

I may have some pet peeves with some statements which I have already addressed. I guess its the lack of critical thinking and understanding of what people say that piss me off. If people were careful and actually thought about what they said, I bet you wouldn't hear a lot of ignorant shit, I am guilty of this stuff too from time to time but I'm trying to minimize it. I would rather see some good debates rather than people hurling insults back and forth getting no where just shutting people into their shells when it comes to threads like these. Just remember, opinions don't automatically = facts.

P.S. This forum is fucking awesome.

P.P.S. SMOKE WEED EVERYDAY, BIG DICKS IN YOUR ASS, LOL JOEY DIAZ.

Just to lighten the mood:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2lGA-GdPSg

[stangvortech]

No offense Tyler, but that is a straight opinionated. No way around it lol come on son. Just saying. I'll agree we have it better in this country than many others, but to bluntly say its the best, is just pure opinionated.

Once again your a idiot if you don’t think we live in the best country in the world. WE DO! If you don’t like here why don’t you go move to la la land. There is plenty of people that are willing to take your place here in the US. just saying.

[Caleb]

The only one that is not realistic here is you. Welcome to the internet. I still think your a idiot on your views. Yes, my post was emotional and I had a few beers beforehand with some friends. I don’t care what people think of me. I don’t care what the reason is people join the military. The fact is they are serving our country and have the high possibility of putting their life on the line and not making it home. It is not 8-5 and you go home every night that is a job. I sure as hell hope they have US interest in mind when setting up the government. I don’t care about the oil to dollar ratio if they changed it and it lowered the price of oil I’m fine with it. We need to be getting oil here and putting in the Keystone pipe line. It does not matter what the "reason" is we went to war. We went to war and accomplished a lot and did 5x the amount of good than bad. Yea, people died it was a WAR that’s what happens when you go to war. When The US goes to war it is for the good not the bad. I think we have enough problems here at home to fix before we go fixing the world’s problems and starting any more wars. You are looking at the glass half empty. On the dollar it is not backed up by anything any more like it once was with gold. In the end shit is going to hit the fan. I would say 5ish years if not before we will have a Greece type situation. The dollar is not worth much anymore anyway and it is not due to military spending it is due to us pissing way too much money down the drain here in the United States and else ware. If we had a conservative government the whole time we would not be in this situation of large debt with stupid government programs like social security, welfare, unemployment and the big joke is Obama care.

The only thing I can think of posting to respond because I am honestly shocked:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MRmxfLuNto

[stangvortech]

The fact that you've only resided in USA I would assume, for 100% of your life would be a bias analysis making it an opinionated answer. Opinions don't = truth in this case. But again, we are lucky to be living in a decent country, where we don't have to go to bed scared wondering whats gonna happen to us in the middle of the night.

Despite me possibly looking like an asshole and pissing off some people and shining a different light on some subjects and being childishly insulted by Stangvortech, I still have nothing against the guy. I in fact, have nothing against anyone on this site frankly (unless you've gotten a bad rep from stealing or some shit). I however, don't have an issue responding and calling out bullshit on dumbass "false narrow minded" opinions and stuff when I see it. But that's just me, If I am wrong on something, I will admit it when I am proven wrong. Only helps further build my knowledge and character being corrected in that way. Just like what's his nuts with the Red GTP here on the forums now. I learned some stuff about the GTP's because I was corrected by someone who had experience with em.

Sledge aka Tyler, decent guy in person.
Civicex aka Dallas, decent guy in person.
Fiddy aka Tyler C, decent guy in person.
Jacob S aka JSherm, decent guy in person.
JustinS aka JSherm#2, decent guy in person.

You know what, I actually think they are all decent people when it comes down to it. I don't know their opinions of me but its whatev's. I don't know a lot of people on the rest of this site, and probably wouldn't mind meeting more people on here as well.

I may have some pet peeves with some statements which I have already addressed. I guess its the lack of critical thinking and understanding of what people say that piss me off. If people were careful and actually thought about what they said, I bet you wouldn't hear a lot of ignorant shit, I am guilty of this stuff too from time to time but I'm trying to minimize it. I would rather see some good debates rather than people hurling insults back and forth getting no where just shutting people into their shells when it comes to threads like these. Just remember, opinions don't automatically = facts.

P.S. This forum is fucking awesome.

P.P.S. SMOKE WEED EVERYDAY, BIG DICKS IN YOUR ASS, LOL JOEY DIAZ.

Just to lighten the mood:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2lGA-GdPSg


I don’t have anything against you either. I just think your views are dumb that is all. I know we all can get along at stuff just fine. When you post your views on line people say stuff. lol When it comes down to all the stuff nothing that you are trying to say means anything with political stuff. Everyone has a opinion and that is that. That is all it comes down to. I’m sure you think I’m an idiot and that is fine with me.

[Caleb]

I don’t have anything against you either. I just think your views are dumb that is all. I know we all can get along at stuff just fine. When you post your views on line people say stuff. lol When it comes down to all the stuff nothing that you are trying to say means anything with political stuff. Everyone has a opinion and that is that. That is all it comes down to. I’m sure you think I’m an idiot and that is fine with me.

It should come down to cold hard facts, not opinions. Its called having truth in the matter with reasonable and critical thinking.

[stangvortech]

It should come down to cold hard facts, not opinions. Its called having truth in the matter with reasonable and critical thinking.




That is what you don’t understand. When it comes down to facts people will have their own opinions. Like who is the Best basketball player? o ok, we can just look at the facts. It does not work like that. Or we would have no goverment no democrats and no republicans. We would just have one guy that thinks reasonable and with critical thinking. lol

[civicex_1134]

<--covering ears in corner.... "JOHN JACOB JINGLE HIMER SCHMIT, HIS NAME IS MY NAME TOO! WHENEVER I GO OUT, THE PEOPLE ALWAYS SHOUT, LALALALALALA!!!!!!!!!"

[Caleb]

That is what you don’t understand. When it comes down to facts people will have their own opinions. Like who is the Best basketball player? o ok, we can just look at the facts. It does not work like that. Or we would have no goverment no democrats and no republicans. We would just have one guy that thinks reasonable and with critical thinking. lol

There's a thing in sports called statistics which records the players performance in certain areas. These are the facts regarding the players performance as well as the game, NOT OPINIONS. So correct me if I am wrong. So you're telling me if I were to say "so and so" is the best player of the superbowl etc because of said stats. You would be to so quick to have an opinion about it yet the stats show that I was correct? Isn't that what the consensus of facts are? To reach a truthful conclusion, not an opinionated one? Facts do work like that, strictly based on evidence. In this example, evidence being the recorded Statistics.

At the end of the day, yes people will have different opinions, but the person with the facts supporting them will be the one with the correct and essentially, right opinion. I just don't see how hard that is to comprehend. In different situations such as supporting and not supporting war, its the morality of what you think is right and wrong and it differs from person to person(and its where you see peoples real world perspective). I for one think its morally wrong to invade another country, kill 100,000+ Iraqi's, instill our own US interest type government that doesn't give a fuck about using its own resources to help its own Iraqi people, all in the name of fighting "terrorism" (an enemy that isn't established and can't be defeated). After the fact of killing all those Iraqi's and blowing up their buildings. US Contracted companies, coming in and "rebuilding" and profiteering off of the "war" is sickening in my eyes. If you honestly believe we went over there just based solely on good intentions without acknowledging all the greed, corruption, massacres and tragedies that went on over there, you have a very blind and narrow/twisted perspective of morality. Especially when you don't acknowledge all the facts and reasoning to go to "war" which is very important. There was few things good that came out of that conflict, the minor reduction of terrorists, getting Saddam and killing his sons, rebuilding little of their communities(despite the greedy intentions behind it) essentially in a vague nut shell. And just to correct you with correct terminology, these were not real wars, they are rightfully considered to be conflicts because the United States Congress did not constitutionally declare war the legal and proper way. However it was adopted in by the media as "The Iraq War" and other names. This is why I put quotes around "war" when I had mentioned it.


The dollar is not worth much anymore anyway and it is not due to military spending.

I'm just pointing this out because there is complete bullshit in this statement as with a lot of stuff you've said, I'm just gonna point out the obvious and leave the rest for people to figure out.

After majority of the all the costs are said and done between the conflicts in Iraq, and Afghanistan, its estimated to be 3+ Trillion on the conservative end, likely higher. That means it has increased our national debt by at least 20%+ comparing it to today's debt of 15.3 Trillion. That's about 20% in an 9 year span since the debt has been going since 1791. Not a lot of it not on military spending? I would highly beg to differ or as I would have originally typed it, "Are you fucking kidding me?"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_cost_of_the_Iraq_War Direct and Indirect War Costs.

[stangvortech]

There's a thing in sports called statistics which records the players performance in certain areas. These are the facts regarding the players performance as well as the game, NOT OPINIONS. So correct me if I am wrong. So you're telling me if I were to say "so and so" is the best player of the superbowl etc because of said stats. You would be to so quick to have an opinion about it yet the stats show that I was correct? Isn't that what the consensus of facts are? To reach a truthful conclusion, not an opinionated one? Facts do work like that, strictly based on evidence. In this example, evidence being the recorded Statistics.

At the end of the day, yes people will have different opinions, but the person with the facts supporting them will be the one with the correct and essentially, right opinion. I just don't see how hard that is to comprehend. In different situations such as supporting and not supporting war, its the morality of what you think is right and wrong and it differs from person to person(and its where you see peoples real world perspective). I for one think its morally wrong to invade another country, kill 100,000+ Iraqi's, instill our own US interest type government that doesn't give a fuck about using its own resources to help its own Iraqi people, all in the name of fighting "terrorism" (an enemy that isn't established and can't be defeated). After the fact of killing all those Iraqi's and blowing up their buildings. US Contracted companies, coming in and "rebuilding" and profiteering off of the "war" is sickening in my eyes. If you honestly believe we went over there just based solely on good intentions without acknowledging all the greed, corruption, massacres and tragedies that went on over there, you have a very blind and narrow/twisted perspective of morality. Especially when you don't acknowledge all the facts and reasoning to go to "war" which is very important. There was few things good that came out of that conflict, the minor reduction of terrorists, getting Saddam and killing his sons, rebuilding little of their communities(despite the greedy intentions behind it) essentially in a vague nut shell. And just to correct you with correct terminology, these were not real wars, they are rightfully considered to be conflicts because the United States Congress did not constitutionally declare war the legal and proper way. However it was adopted in by the media as "The Iraq War" and other names. This is why I put quotes around "war" when I had mentioned it.



I'm just pointing this out because there is complete bullshit in this statement as with a lot of stuff you've said, I'm just gonna point out the obvious and leave the rest for people to figure out.

After majority of the all the costs are said and done between the conflicts in Iraq, and Afghanistan, its estimated to be 3+ Trillion on the conservative end, likely higher. That means it has increased our national debt by at least 20%+ comparing it to today's debt of 15.3 Trillion. That's about 20% in an 9 year span since the debt has been going since 1791. Not a lot of it not on military spending? I would highly beg to differ or as I would have originally typed it, "Are you fucking kidding me?"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_cost_of_the_Iraq_War Direct and Indirect War Costs.

lol bla bla bla im done here. I dont have time for this crap. I'm not even going to read all that.

[Clinical]

lol bla bla bla im done here. I dont have time for this crap. I'm not even going to read all that.

and this is why you lose the argument.

I'll just say caleb's right.

The worst thing said in this thread was that we live in the best country.

[Chase]

I would like to hear peoples opinions on:

Capitalism

Discuss.

[SledgeWS6]

Sledge aka Tyler, decent guy in person.
Civicex aka Dallas, decent guy in person.
Fiddy aka Tyler C, decent guy in person.
Jacob S aka JSherm, decent guy in person.
JustinS aka JSherm#2, decent guy in person.
Johnny aka Stangvortech, decent guy in person.

Agreed. I wasn't trying to state an arguement, rather justifying others. I know your beliefs Caleb, you know mine, and for the most part we're on the same page. Johnny B (StangVortech) and are on the same page as well. We've had MANY discussions and many drunken nights, haha.


go ahead and reference that constitution we don't follow it anyway...

I could EASILY exercise #1 if you really want me to. ;)

[AutoMods]

the oil and currency issue is interesting. just looked up and read an article about it. But i'd have to do a lot of reading before I could responsibly take a stand and say why things happen the way they do.

You will also notice very few people of significant political standing will ever give the time of day to the idea that 911 was an inside job. Now "conspiracy theorists" will say because they are in on it and want to keep hush about it, but in reality the idea is so far fetched that most people of high standing, media outlets, political debates, etc etc don't even discuss it because it is on the same level as ufo talk.

[Stutz]

ufos are real..

[JacobS]

this country is the best when it comes to certain situations...but canadas looking better and better every year....but its so damn cold!

[LT1Dan]

I would like to hear peoples opinions on:

Capitalism

Discuss.

There are too many restrictions on business. Corporations should be completely unregulated and let the free market decide who lives and dies. Literally.

/trollface

[Caleb]

the oil and currency issue is interesting. just looked up and read an article about it. But i'd have to do a lot of reading before I could responsibly take a stand and say why things happen the way they do.

You will also notice very few people of significant political standing will ever give the time of day to the idea that 911 was an inside job. Now "conspiracy theorists" will say because they are in on it and want to keep hush about it, but in reality the idea is so far fetched that most people of high standing, media outlets, political debates, etc etc don't even discuss it because it is on the same level as ufo talk.

Look up the "petrol dollar theory" and the reason why I had mentioned it because many economic experts have considered to it be economically true, however since we've had no real life examples of it actually happening, we can't necessarily claim the validity, that's why its only considered a theory at this point, but I imagine we'll be finding out in the future. The outcome is scary though.

But I don't think it falls in the lines of UFO's, however the phrase "conspiracy theorist" gets some pretty crude looks now-a-days and people want to avoid that bad image.

[LT1Dan]

this country is the best when it comes to certain situations...but canadas looking better and better every year....but its so damn cold!

I take back all those nice things I said about you yesterday. Canada is only good for maple syrup, hockey and keeping those damn Alaskans from coming down to the real USA. Canada is responsible for Justin Beiber! Case closed.

[civicex_1134]

^got a valid point there.... lol

[Domestic Disturbance]

keeping those damn Alaskans from coming down .

Goddamn polar gooks!